Joan Tardà: "In 2028, I would like Oriol Junqueras to be president of Catalonia and Salvador Illa vice president."

BarcelonaJoan Tardà is a former member of Congress and has recently published A Republican Chronicle from Madrid (Viena Edicions), where he recounts his fifteen years as a member of parliament in the Spanish capital.

We begin at the end of the book, where he discusses the left-wing front he has long advocated. Does he see it as feasible now?

— It would be interesting to see all the pro-self-determination, pro-independence, and pro-sovereignty forces united on a single ballot, without abandoning the party's logos, and incorporating representatives of social movements. The only way to reverse this disaffection is to do what people no longer expect the left to do: unite. If we don't do it now, when will we? When Catalan identity and the working class begin to suffer the consequences of eight years of right-wing rule in Spain?

Why do you think the party leaderships are so reluctant to talk about it, starting with ERC?

— Because they usually have difficulty leaving their comfort zones. Why not? Why isn't it worth it from a polling standpoint? Everyone will have to come out and explain why or why not.

Those who are not in favor argue that each party has its own space and point to Junts pel Sí.

— It's not comparable for two reasons. First, because Junts pel Sí was a cross-class pact. Later, it was proven that those of us who said it was a bad deal were right, but we accepted it because otherwise Artur Mas wouldn't have gone ahead. And second, because it was about checkmating the State by proclaiming the Catalan Republic, which is why it was necessary to amass as much strength as possible, assuming the thesis being defended was plausible. Now it's not about that. It's about resisting, about stopping the coup.

As Àgora, the internal current of ERC that he leads: when and how do you plan to open this debate?

— We will debate with all the party's grassroots members. And the leadership will propose how the debate will be organized. We are working to ensure that Junqueras becomes president of Catalonia in 2028 and leads a left-wing government, provided that the members of Esquerra nominate him as their candidate.

Should Gabriel Rufián be the candidate for this left-wing front? The book says he is "the great asset of pro-independence republicanism in the present and undoubtedly in the future."

— Yes, I say that, and that Oriol Junqueras not only deserves to be the candidate, but he also has to be. I'm very proud of Rufián because never before has an ERC member—that is, an independentist, a republican, a leftist, and the son of a working-class family—been so popular in Catalonia and beyond. He represents the republican movement's desire to move away from this tribal concept of Catalans and build what we call the republican nation.

But should Rufián lead the coalition in the State?

— I appreciate Rufián's ability to shake things up on the Spanish left, because it makes no sense to lose votes outside of Catalonia. Rufián's proposal has woken them up a bit.

He has been criticized for issuing a kind of challenge to ERC.

— I don't perceive it as a power struggle. I have the feeling that Rufián has managed to place an enormous elephant inside this room on the left, an elephant that, even if it wanted to, couldn't get out because the room is too small.

In the book, he explains several times that he is always in favor of extending a hand to the PSC. Should ERC approve the budget?

— Esquerra should demand that the PSOE fulfill its commitments and should do its part to help them do so. The correct approach is one that balances confrontation and collaboration. The PSOE has to deliver, and it would be good if Esquerra also helped them to do so.

In what sense?

— That he lowered the bar a bit on reality. Are budgets necessary? I think so, especially given the current situation following the war. But the Socialist Party has to deliver, because otherwise, trust will erode. I campaigned for a "yes" vote in favor of President Illa's investiture, and the previous leadership, with Marta Rovira, conducted very good negotiations.

Would you be in favor of Esquerra joining the government?

— If we reach 2028 and both sides make a positive assessment, who knows if a governing pact, or a coalition government, might not be possible. I would like Oriol Junqueras as president of Catalonia and Salvador Illa as vice president. I would like this left-wing front, if it doesn't win, to at least achieve such a strong result that there could be a coalition government with Illa as president if he wins, but with vice presidents from the CUP, Esquerra, and Comuns, preventing the PSC from sliding towards Spanish nationalism.

Let's talk for a moment about Junts. In the book, you refer to the moment when Puigdemont failed to be invested as president. Was that a turning point in the Junts-Esquerra relationship?

— The decline of Junts has been anything but patriotic. They were caught off guard by the beginning of the post-independence period with the need to refound a new party, and they had two paths: to refound themselves by accepting the reality that they hadn't reached the summit; or to accept this and prioritize the formation of the new party. They opted for the quick route, which was to parasitize Esquerra, and to do so, they had to denigrate it. This myth of "botiflerisme" was created, the betrayal that some of us have suffered quite a bit from, and ERC was associated with surrender to such an extent that it has had to do the work alone.

One of the things Junts criticized was the fact that Gabriel Rufián speaks in Spanish in Congress now that it is possible to speak in Catalan.

— To advocate for independence in Spanish is the great victory. The problem is that a sector of the independence movement is experiencing the current moment with bitterness, with frustration. We mustn't succumb to the visceral, gut-wrenching nationalist impulses. Otherwise, the alternative is entrenchment. Alliance is entrenchment. Now we must act openly, even if it means taking friendly fire, that is, fire from Junts.

In 2011, he had reservations about Oriol Junqueras becoming president of ERC. However, at the party congress two years ago, he supported Junqueras' candidacy.

— Yes, his intellectual capacity, the dignity with which he has faced repression... I think he deserves a chance. However, the leaders of 2017 can only become true leaders of the future if they know how to reinvent themselves. That is, to create a more disruptive discourse, and I believe that today, opting for left-wing unity is a way to accumulate all the legitimacy you have from your popularity, your experience, and your dignity.

Regarding the cartel scandal, the book explains that the final report from the Consell de Garanties has yet to be presented to the Consell Nacional.

— Based on the report of the truth commission and that of the complianceThe Consell de Garanties has to issue the report. I requested it and they told me it was about to be issued.

At the time, they received criticism for the report they made in the truth commission.

— We were very rigorous, we worked hard for two months. Some party members refused to appear, and I highlighted that because I felt it was only fair. We only set three conditions for the leadership's proposal: that it be a diverse commission; that we set a timeframe; and that the conclusions be read before the plenary session of the national congress. Now, responsibilities must be determined, or individuals must be held accountable.