Philippe Lazzarini: "There is a growing awareness in Israel that the war cannot have been waged in the name of everyone."

BarcelonaPhilippe Lazzarini (Neuchâtel, 1964) is the Commissioner General of the United Nations Relief and Works Agency for Palestine Refugees (UNRWA), an organization founded in 1949 that operates in Gaza, the West Bank, Jordan, Lebanon, and Syria. Since October 7, 2023, Tel Aviv has accused the agency of ties to Hamas and has banned it from entering Israel, a decision that effectively limits its operations in Gaza and the West Bank. Lazzarini is visiting Barcelona to participate in the World in Progress forum.

What is your opinion on Trump's peace plan?

— The good news is that we have a ceasefire, and it's holding. It's been under enormous pressure due to violations, but it's still holding. This means Palestinians don't have to worry every second about being killed. But obviously, people are still in shock from what has happened over the past two years: there has been an enormous level of destruction and a very high number of casualties. Now, we all hope that the second phase will take hold and that critical needs to save lives will be addressed. But at the same time, if we want to consolidate the ceasefire, the other phases of the plan must be addressed. This has to do with the future governance of Gaza, with the future security configuration. We must create the conditions for sufficient trust to begin investing in Gaza's recovery. There is still a long way to go, so the negotiating countries must remain fully engaged.

How do you see the future of Gaza? Should UNRWA be involved in governance?

— Whatever the future of Gaza, it must be embedded within the commitment to the two-state solution. And Gaza must be linked to the West Bank and East Jerusalem. Now, for future governance, I don't think UNRWA should be part of it. But it's important that the Palestinian authorities be part of it. It's necessary that the Palestinians take ownership of the governance that will be established. What's essential for UNRWA is that we resume our services as soon as possible, especially education services. We have more than 700,000 deeply traumatized school-aged children in Gaza. They've already lost more than two years, and if we want to avoid having a completely lost generation, we must find ways to return them to education and learning.

You've described the situation in Gaza as a "man-made hell." How can the crimes committed be judged?

— Well, I've said many times that we're dealing with a man-made and man-made hunger, and that it can be easily addressed. It only takes political will. Now that we have a ceasefire, I hope and trust that with the humanitarian community, if it's allowed to deliver assistance on a large scale and uninterrupted, we can address the still-worsening hunger. But, regarding all the violations of humanitarian law we've seen in the last two years, the large-scale forced displacement, the targeting of civilians, I hope there will be the necessary accountability for any other crimes against humanity committed in Gaza.

Have you been surprised by the lack of response from Israeli civil society to what the UN has called a genocide in Gaza?

— The UN Commission of Inquiry concluded that genocide had been committed. But there are also Israeli entities like B'Tselem, like Physicians for Human Rights, and other voices in Israeli civil society that have concluded the same. So, there is awareness, but these voices remain in the minority. We must never forget what happened. October 7 also caused profound national trauma in Israel. Its response caused equally profound trauma in Gaza and beyond, as well as great outrage, because, fundamentally, it was a response without any respect for the rule of law. And this is why we have seen what we have seen in Gaza; it is why people have experienced hell in all its possible forms. But I remain confident that there is a growing awareness—including within Israeli society—that what has been committed cannot have been committed in the name of everyone.

At least 320 of your workers died in Gaza. When you hear people accusing them of terrorism, what comes to mind?

— Calling UNWA a terrorist organization further endangers its workers. And that accusation shouldn't be made lightly. There have been several accusations in recent years. Those that have been substantiated have been investigated, but no investigation has resulted in a definitive conclusion. Many, I believe, are part of a disinformation campaign aimed at discrediting the agency. Because whenever we ask if they can please substantiate the accusation, we receive no response, neither from the Israeli authorities nor from any of Israel's allies.

You're banned in Israel, and so is your agency. What do you think is really behind this campaign?

— The primary objective is political. The authors of the Knesset bill banning UNRWA's presence in East Jerusalem and forcing the departure of international staff aim to dismantle the agency and deprive Palestinians of refugee status. They hope to resolve the issue of the right of return for Palestinian refugees once and for all, once a lasting political solution is reached. But there are other objectives as well: the agency has been vehement in denouncing violations in the Strip. And we have seen that anyone who has spoken out on human rights or humanitarian law issues has also been silenced. It is no coincidence that no international journalist has been allowed to enter Gaza and report independently.

We've seen a growing questioning of international law. What does this leave an agency like UNRWA?

— The multilateral system and organizations like the United Nations are under great pressure. International law has been questioned and disparaged; and the international judicial system is under attack. Ultimately, what's at stake is the rules-based order that the international community inherited after the Second World War. That's what's being challenged today. But I hope that, despite all this pressure, reason will prevail and that no country, whatever its agenda, will throw international humanitarian law into the trash.

You recently said you wouldn't be able to pay your employees' salaries in September. Are you worried about the future of UNRWA?

— Of course, I'm very worried. We're constantly struggling to maintain the agency's services. I certainly said this in August. Now we're in October, and I know we'll be able to pay salaries at the end of the month. But I have no certainty for November. We're constantly on the edge, and we can't make any predictions beyond 30 days.

What do you think about the role of the international community since the ceasefire and specifically the EU, which on Monday backed down on imposing sanctions on Netanyahu?

— I can't comment on the decision, but I think we must maintain constant pressure on both Israel and Hamas to ensure they respect the ceasefire. And I think the European Union should not shy away from using the tools at its disposal to play its part in ensuring that Israel respects human rights in the future.