Yadvinder Malhi: "The message 'we have five years to save the planet' is paralyzing; we need to change the narrative."

When he was six years old, his parents sent him to live with his grandparents in Punjab for a year, hoping he would understand his Indian roots. That experience profoundly marked him. It was nothing like his native Essex, in the United Kingdom, which was much grayer and more industrial, and it instilled in Yadvinder Malhi (High Wycombe, UK, 1968) an admiration, curiosity, and passion for nature. Today, this professor of ecosystem science at the University of Oxford is one of the world's most recognized scientific voices in the integration of ecosystem ecology into Earth sciences. His work on climate change and biodiversity loss, especially in tropical forests, has been fundamental. For this reason, he was awarded the 21st Ramon Margalef Prize for Ecology 2025, granted by the Government of Catalonia.

Malhi speaks with ARA in the main lecture hall of the Faculty of Biology at the University of Barcelona, ​​where students gradually enter and sit attentively to listen to him. Like a true Brit, he gets restless when he has to keep them waiting.

He is an unconventional ecologist: in fact, he started studying physics because he wanted to be an astronomer and began his career as a meteorologist.

— Studying physics at university, I realized that doing astronomy meant spending many hours sitting behind a computer. And I liked being outdoors, surrounded by the things I was studying, doing fieldwork, feeling that humility of being surrounded by the object of your study. It was the 1980s, climate change was beginning to emerge as an area of study, and I was greatly influenced by the books of James Lovelock and his Gaia theory Beyond the controversial details, it offered a vision of the world as an interconnected whole that greatly inspired me. It was then that I realized I wanted to use my physics knowledge to address global challenges like climate change, and also to understand how the world works.

And this is ecology.

— That's right, the science of the natural world and how everything fits together, a way to appreciate the wonder of the living world, how it works, and the mysteries we still don't understand. It's also one of the most important sciences because it allows us to think holistically about the challenges we face and the interconnections between species, between humans and non-humans. Studying physics taught me to simplify complexity. There's a very famous textbook called Consider a spherical cowHe argues that if you want to calculate the energy of a cow, it's easy to assume it's a sphere. That way, the math is simple. Obviously, a cow isn't a sphere, but the question is: how far can you go with this simplification before you need to add legs, or none at all? This way of thinking allows you to approach complex systems, like a rainforest, starting from basic principles and adding complexity as needed. And I think that Margalef, despite not being a physicist by training, thought in a way very close to the physical sciences, looking for underlying patterns of energy and ecosystem response. In his time, it was a very uncommon and original perspective.

He says he likes doing science in difficult places.

— My PhD was in meteorology and climate, which led me to work extensively in West Africa, Niger, and the Sahel, studying water and drought, trying to understand the extent to which degradation from overgrazing affected plant transpiration and contributed to drought. Although we eventually found it wasn't as significant, as the primary source was the ocean. But I did discover that I enjoyed doing science in challenging environments, camping in the Sahel with Fulani nomads under the stars, searching. I also realized I had a knack for doing technical work in difficult places and enjoying it, as well as the culture, the food, and the connection with the people.

— Then I was hired as a postdoc to go to Brazil. At that time, a new technology for measuring carbon fluxes was emerging, and we wanted to know if the Amazon absorbed carbon dioxide and to what extent it helped slow climate change. To find out, we built a tower in the rainforest to measure the carbon flux—"the breath of the forest"—for a year. That work showed that yes, the forest does absorb CO₂, and that the rate of climate change would be 20% faster if rainforests didn't absorb carbon. And while I was in Brazil, I learned Portuguese in the bars of Manaus and fell in love with the rainforest. Looking at a map and seeing that the rainforest stretched a thousand kilometers in every direction was breathtaking. Humanity seemed so small in those dimensions...

Since then, he has focused his research on studying the most complex ecosystem, the Amazon rainforest.

— In fact, I learned ecology in Brazil, partly because I had to wait months for my research materials to clear customs. This meant I spent a lot of time in the library reading about tropical ecology. I'm very proud of the work we did there because it helped protect the Amazon. We demonstrated the rainforest's role as a carbon sink, and this influenced the Brazilian government, which declared that deforestation had to be stopped. Until then, the prevailing discourse was "we have to cut down the rainforest to develop," but this changed thanks to science and also because we trained Brazilian scientists who later went on to hold positions in government and NGOs. There were strong local voices who understood why the Amazon was important, and this helped change its future.

Why is the rainforest crucial to understanding the effects of the climate crisis?

— The tropics are the most climatically stable regions on the planet, and therefore, even a small temperature change can force species into conditions they haven't faced for millions of years. It's crucial to understand the extent to which forests can adapt to these changes and what happens if they can't, because this affects the entire planet: if the Amazon goes from being a carbon sink to a carbon source, stabilizing the climate will become much more difficult, because it could shift from helping us curb the climate crisis to accelerating it. That's why understanding the limits is essential to protecting and maintaining the Amazon: it's vital for our future.

What are the main threats facing the Amazon?

— Historically, deforestationIt is now decreasing thanks to policies by the Brazilian government and others. But fire is emerging as a new threat: the climate is drying out the rainforest, and this, combined with deforestation, creates conditions for fires to spread.

Is there still time to recover lost habitats?

— It depends. Restoring the exact landscape that existed before is very difficult, especially because the climate is already different. But we can restore ecological processes, semi-natural systems that are adaptable to climate change. That is, a mature Amazonian forest takes centuries to recover its complexity, but we can restore some of that functionality. And that is already valuable. We must stop lamenting that we cannot return to the past and focus on what we can improve. In Oxford, I direct the Center for Nature Recovery or Nature Recovery Center. We define "recovery" as "helping life to thrive by restoring the relationship of humans with the rest of the natural world." It is about helping life to thrive—not returning to the past—it is about restoring relationships—personal, social, political—and recognizing that humanity is part of the natural world, not separate from it.

Does this also apply in Europe?

— Exactly. Whether in the Amazon, the agricultural landscapes of Europe, or in cities, we must apply this mindset everywhere.

According to the Food and Agriculture Organization of the United Nations (FAO), agriculture causes at least 50% of global deforestation, mainly for the production ofpalm oil and soybeans.

— The global footprint of agriculture appears to have stabilized and is even beginning to decline. In Spain, for example, there is significant rural depopulation. This presents challenges, but it also offers opportunities for nature. We can practice more sustainable agriculture, creating natural corridors between fields and designing landscapes with nature in mind. It is also true that the human population will begin to stabilize within 20 or 30 years. This could create opportunities to restore nature if we are prepared to utilize it.

Meanwhile, Trump is targeting oil and gas resources in a protected area of Alaska, a refuge for Arctic wildlife.

— We must continue fighting against these actions and denouncing them. But it is also necessary to offer a narrative of hope. We are currently in a politically complex moment, but I believe we must plant seeds for when the pendulum swings again. Perhaps people have grown tired of disaster stories and are looking for simpler narratives. We must offer stories of a future where humans and nature thrive together under a stable climate. In fact, I am working with the United Nations Development Programme to create a new Human Development Index that incorporates our relationship with nature. The idea is that development should not be measured solely by human well-being, but also by the well-being of the biosphere.

Optimistic by nature?

— I define myself as a "clairvoyant optimist," which means understanding the problem without minimizing it, but asking ourselves what we can do. The narrative of "we have five years to save the planet" can be useful for mobilizing people, but it also paralyzes them. We need to change the narrative: working with nature to restore it gives meaning and hope.

What does receiving the Margalef award mean to you?

— I am deeply honored for many reasons. Margalef is a pivotal figure in ecology, the first great ecologist of Catalonia and Spain. Interestingly, I hadn't read much of his work until now, but while preparing for the award, I immersed myself in it and was surprised by how advanced many of his ideas were. Perhaps they didn't receive the recognition they deserved in the English-speaking world, but they remain highly relevant today. I also find it admirable that a government dedicates so much energy to an ecology prize named after one of its scientists. It's a magnificent way to celebrate ecological science and its importance to society.